The ketogenic diet and cancer

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The ketogenic diet and cancer

by chalmj on Sat Dec 31, 2016 06:46 PM

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Is anyone else using the ketogenic diet to treat their cancer?

I have been on the diet since Sept 2016 and now in Dec 2016 I can see my tumor, visible in the oral cavity, regressing!

The ketogenic diet is a mechansim to help keep blood glucose low. I use a macronutrient tracking tool called cronometer availabe for free at cronometer.com to help achieve the marconutrient targets.

Dr. Joesph Mercola helped establish the macronutrient targets at cronometer for cancer patients which are 20g/day carbohydrates, 50g/day protein, 250g/day fat.

I measure blood glucose and blood keytones daily. I find I have to plan meals ahead of time and measure out what I eat to be able to achieve these strict targets. 

If you go out to you tube and search the ketogenic diet and cancer you will find there is a hugh amount of scientific, doctor research and information that may convince you as it did me of this approach.

I'm into my fourth year since diagnosed, my tumor is extensive, but finally I found something that works. I think this avodiance of carbohydrates should work on any cancer as they all seem to need a lot of glucose. It makes sense that lowering blood glucose weakens and even starves cancer cells.

John

 

RE: The ketogenic diet and cancer

by chalmj on Fri Apr 21, 2017 05:58 PM

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Would be like to hear from anyone using the ketogenic diet to lower blood glucose to weaken even starve cancer cells.

I continue using a web macronutrient tracking tool to track my intake of carbohydrates, protein and fat in an attempt to meet the macronutrient targets needed for the diet to be effective. I have been in clinical ketosis (above .5) since Sept 2016 and my HNSCC tumor continues to shrink!! 

I find I am feeling great. All the hype surrounding this diet, lower inflammation, boundless energy, lifts brain fog, anti-aging are actually true. At this point I would recommend this diet to anyone just for the fun if you want to feel great. I guess keeping our blood glucose low makes us feel great.

RE: The ketogenic diet and cancer

by skopro on Sat Jun 10, 2017 04:25 PM

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On Dec 31, 2016 6:46 PM chalmj wrote:

Is anyone else using the ketogenic diet to treat their cancer?

I have been on the diet since Sept 2016 and now in Dec 2016 I can see my tumor, visible in the oral cavity, regressing!

The ketogenic diet is a mechansim to help keep blood glucose low. I use a macronutrient tracking tool called cronometer availabe for free at cronometer.com "" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://cronometer.com " target="_blank" rel="nofollow">cronometer.com to help achieve the marconutrient targets.

Dr. Joesph Mercola helped establish the macronutrient targets at cronometer for cancer patients which are 20g/day carbohydrates, 50g/day protein, 250g/day fat.

I measure blood glucose and blood keytones daily. I find I have to plan meals ahead of time and measure out what I eat to be able to achieve these strict targets. 

If you go out to you tube and search the ketogenic diet and cancer you will find there is a hugh amount of scientific, doctor research and information that may convince you as it did me of this approach.

I'm into my fourth year since diagnosed, my tumor is extensive, but finally I found something that works. I think this avodiance of carbohydrates should work on any cancer as they all seem to need a lot of glucose. It makes sense that lowering blood glucose weakens and even starves cancer cells.

John

 

John---

I have been doing a modified keto diet for maybe a year and was diagnosed Feb 1-2017 w squamous carcinoma of the lung, w tumor almost doubling in three plus months to 5.6x5.0 cm.  I have had to cut back the keto diet, which included intermittent fasting maybe 4-5- days a week, bcs am starting on a supplement protocol that requires some ingredients to be taken w food.

I enjoyed keto but was having trouble finding enough good-fat food and low enough protein & carbs to satisfy the mercola standards.  One thing was roasted eggplant slices loaded w olive oil and coconut oil, plus other roasted veg slathered with oils.  As per Ron Rose, cancer sufferers must also maintain lower protein as well as carbs as (he declares) too much protein may drive metasteses.  Another med researcher (reacting to Seyfried, Attia, D'Augustino, etc.) says re cancer cells:  "You block glucose, they use glutamine," Dang says, in reference to another primary fuel used by cancers. "You block glucose and glutamine, they might be able to use fatty acids. We don't know yet."

Sorry to inject such disorganized reactions to your message but I hope we might entice others to discuss the true benefits or over-promise of keto.

Stefanos

RE: The ketogenic diet and cancer

by chalmj on Sat Jun 10, 2017 06:13 PM

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Stefanos,

I'm sorry to hear about your lung tumor. I don't understand how the tumor could double in 3 months on a modified ketogenic diet. I'm thinking maybe you did not implement the diet correctly.

Are you using a macronutrient tracking tool? I don't think I could be successful implementing the diet without one like cronometer.  

Are you measuring blood keytones and blood glucose? Again I don't think I would be successful without these measurements. The tool and the measurements turn this into controlled science. 

I highly recommend Dr. Mercolas new book - Fat for Fuel. It gets into detail how to nurish your mitocondria. He calls it metabolic mitocondrial therapy(MMT). In this book he details exactly how to do this right.  

I keep my intermittent fasting window to 3 hrs - 6P - 9P every day. I don't get hungry because I have 2 tbls of kerrygold unsalted butter, and or 2 tbls of coconut oil and or 2 tbls of MCT oil with tea every morning as breakfast. These fats fill me up so I don't get hungry until 6P.

As time passes I grow more confident in this approach as my tumor continues to shrink. A conservative estimate is 30% now in about 9 months. 

I also do the Bravo probiotic GcMAF yogurt which I believe is doing exactly what it says it does which is activating macrophages. HNSCC keeps macrophages deactivated in the SCC tumor microenvironment (called a TAM or tumor associated macrophage - meaning the tumor will not allow the macrophage to activate). 

Here is a link to a study where they found a probiotic was as effective as the new 2016 released HNSCC immunotherapy PD1/PDL1 checkpoint inhibitor drugs (are these drugs available to you / lung cancer patients as a first line treatment yet?) at shrinking tumors in mice:

https://news.uchicago.edu/article/2015/11/06/gut-bacteria-ca

I believe it is the probiotic that is shrinking the tumor yet it might not be successful without the diet if the tumor where to get all the glucose it needs to thrive. 

I have heard that about glutamine and fatty acids but I don't believe it to be accurate. Cancer cells need such large amounts of glucose, 100 times more than normal cells, they have 100 times more insulin receptors to get this glucose, and they need it constantly, there is simply not enough glutamine or fatty acids to fill in when glucose levels are reduced. 

I just read an article where they indicated SCC needs more glucose than any other cancer type. 

Consider getting the book, turn the diet into science with a macronutrient tracker and blood measurements and definitely consider a probiotic approach.

Consider  supplementing with inulin fiber. I buy 1 lb of powder for $10.00, lasts months, just need a few grams a day. This is a prebiotic that feeds and strengthens your indiginous probiotic population you have had since birth. If you have had any insults, usually through antibiotics or diet (too much sugar), to your gut flora this will help recovery. 

Consider getting some fulvic acid or shilajit, soil based metabolites (chemicals from soil bacteria) that helps to tighten gut junctions by increasing gut flora communication.  

John 

RE: The ketogenic diet and cancer

by chalmj on Sat Jun 10, 2017 06:26 PM

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try that probiotic mouse study link again:

https://news.uchicago.edu/article/2015/11/06/gut-bacteria-ca

RE: The ketogenic diet and cancer

by skopro on Sat Jun 10, 2017 07:39 PM

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Thnx for all the incisive info; you sure are far far ahead of my understanding of where I am or where I need to go in trying to avoid chemo-rads.  My keto diet hasn't been strict, just an attempt to ban all sugar, sink carbs to a minimum and perhaps I've been eating too much protein, tho much of the diet for me is vege, fish, some chix/pork, little beef but an occasional grass-fed steak--basically water, tea or some coffee (I don't drink alcohol at all).  My weight's been steady @ 130-135.  Every time I take Mercola's MCT oil, it gives me awful trots.  I used to make my own kefir daily, make sauerkraut and other fermento stuff, made raw milk but now have cut out dairy almost completely to see if it'll lighten a rheumatoid A joints problem.

I signed up for the keto cronometer but am totally confused about how it works--even how to calc BMI correctly.  I'm not a complete techno-klutz but sure am challenged (no smart phone; win 7 laptop).  I don't know how striuctly I can do keto now that I'm starting on a supplements protocol which requires, among other ingredients, 3000 mg Vit C a day to be taken w meals.  So my old one meal a day fasting has fallen by the wayside.

On Feb 1, my tumor was 3.9x3.7 cm, no METS but the tumor was "encasing" the pulmonary vein/arteries; now it's bigger.  Maybe my keto diet was imperfect (or highly imperfect) but it can't have been off that by much, unless not enough calorie restriction (my eatring window was 4-7 pm) and I rarely even did bulletproof coffee in the am; just skipped all breakfast.

Anyway, whether bad luck, mean tumor or unsteady keto diet, the CT scan numbers are what they are.  I'm still resisting chemo/rads and not really feeling symptoms beyond slight decrease in wind dept. and a bit more fatigue when walking.  I used to swim, bike and exercise a lot but ortho problems and the cancer have slowed me down.  I still walk a brisk 35-40 minutes but not as fast as usual.

So there's my detailed tale of woe.  Make of it what you will.  I appreciate your advice & concern. 

RE: The ketogenic diet and cancer

by skopro on Tue Jun 13, 2017 05:49 PM

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add to reply the other day:  I've reserved Mercola book at library; univ of Chicago mouse article re bifidobacterium v. interesting but how do we know to get specific bifido into home-made yogurt or kefir?  Is it in the yogurt culture you recommend?

I've researched some ketone meters & found one at Dr Jockers website called Ketonix.  Many thanx for your advice; keep it up if you wish, I appreciate it.  Stefanos

RE: The ketogenic diet and cancer

by chalmj on Tue Jun 13, 2017 10:39 PM

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Hi Stefanos,

Fat for Fuel is a newly released book so I wonder how long it will take for the library to get it? Can you ask them? 

In the meantime if you search the mercola video library or just search on you tube he discusses mitocondrial health in several videos. He is all about this stuff because the latest science says cancer cells simply can't use fat for fuel. Basically it's a high fat diet eating lots of healthy fats like grassfed cow butter like Kerrygold, coconut oil, MCT oil, avacadoes, olive oil, etc. 

I read Bravo yogurt was developed in a lab to assure it generates GcMAF. It has 42 different strains where most yogurts have 4 to 6 strains. I saw Trader Joes kefir had 12 strains. 

Probably the best way to have some confidence the strains needed to shrink tumors are in the yogurt is to get the lab tested Bravo. Also, please keep in mind I am actually using Bravo and seeing my tumor shrink.  

In that article they did mention bifidus as the effective strains but never got specific so I'm not sure which strains to look for in a grocery store yogurt. I did see a 6 strain plain (must be plain, no added sugar) yogurt at Trader Joes that had 2 bifidus strains. Most yogurts had no bifidus strains. 

For ketone meters Precision Xtra is recommend by doctors in several videos including Dr. Mercola, Dr D'Agostino, Dr. Travis Christofferson. Check out the videos of Dr. Mercola interviewing these doctors and even Dr. Thomas N. Seyfried. 

I currently use NovaMax for taking blood keytone readings. The keytone test strips are cheaper for the NovaMax and just as accurate. I used both meters for several weeks to assure they agreed with each other. 

Have to checked out cronometer? It is free. Have some fun entering  the food you eat and see how much protein and carbs your eating. You have to limit protein too as our livers turn protein into glucose. I read 53% of an egg which is mostly protein turns into glucose in the body.

John

RE: The ketogenic diet and cancer

by chalmj on Wed Jun 14, 2017 04:26 PM

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Stefanos,

I read to avoid sugar a few months after diagnosis. Knowing this I still failed for years to get my blood glucose down. In my experience the only way to achieve the goal is to do this with science through cronometer striving to achieve the macronutrient targets established for cancer patients and verify results by blood glucose measurement.

Don't let supplements get in the way. At one time I was drinking 60 grams/day of liposomal vitamin c with no correlation to eating. Skip the BMI measurement, it is not critical to the goal. Let cronomter estimate it based on your height and weight. That is all I have done. The key for cronometer is to track how many carbs your eating. 

Calorie restriction on a ketogenic diet should be avoided. Carbs are low, protein moderate and fat is high for total calorie intake. It is a high fat diet. You should not skip breakfast but rather eat something high in fat. I do this with butter, or coconut oil or MCT oil in my moring tea. When you eat a high fat breakfast this will fill you up until dinner. If you skip it you will end up wanting to eat lunch.

The key thing to remember is that cancer cannot use fat for fuel - like the book title.

 It makes me so happy to hear you are resisting chemo/rad. Welcome to the club of I guess just the two of us. But you can't fool around. I'm now 4.5 years into this and my tumor grew extensively at various times. While it spread I never felt a thing. Can you see your tumor? I never experienced a wind depth issue. 

Are you sure it's the cancer that slowed you down? I have extensive HNSCC cancer now all over my left side oral cavity, yet I have boundless enegry.

If you research the ketogenic diet you will be amazed at the health benifit claims such as anti-inflammatory, anti-aging, clears brain fog, increased energy and much more. I'm here to verify that these claims are true. I would recommend this diet to anyone, not just cancer patients, as a truely worthwhile epigenetic experience.  

If you take this path I am on, I have learned you must control/ lower blood glucose and verify it with measurement.

John

RE: The ketogenic diet and cancer

by jackstew on Sun Oct 29, 2017 05:23 AM

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Did you pass on radiation treatments completely?  I am newly diagnosed with cancer and 21st Century Oncology wants to do six weeks of radiation on my nose area where a nerve has a tumor which couldn't be removed by MOHS surgery.  Am wondering if I should skip the radiation and just go with the ketogenic diet.  I am also going to look into the probiotic and prebiotic you mentioned.  I am currently taking VSL#3 which I buy at Costco (it has 112.5 billion bacteria per capsule and I believe about ten strains).

Jack

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